Hop additions

[MARMITE]

Can anyone advise me about the rationale behind adding late hops(last 15 mins of boil) if they stay in after the boil for say 30 mins while the wort cools. Surely they are not in long enough to extract a lot of bitterness and what bitterness they do extract might be harsh. In addition won't any flavour or aroma be driven off because the hops will be actually in the wort for 45 mins.

[Steve Urquell]

Can anyone advise me about the rationale behind adding late hops(last 15 mins of boil) if they stay in after the boil for say 30 mins while the wort cools. Surely they are not in long enough to extract a lot of bitterness and what bitterness they do extract might be harsh. In addition won't any flavour or aroma be driven off because the hops will be actually in the wort for 45 mins.
These additions are for flavor/aroma only and do not significantly add to bitterness.It takes longer than 20mins boiling to extract bitterness with the longer boiling times leading to more bitterness.To keep as much flavor/aroma in the beer from late additions it is best to cover the pot immediately after the last addition/flameout and cool it rapidly,preferably w/ a wort chiller.Flavor can also be added in the form of "dry hops" which are additions of hops to the fermenter after the primary fermentation has ceased and 7-14 days before bottling.Hope this helps!:alc:
P.S.-Late hop additions can define the style of a beer.Ex.-S.N.P.A.-This beers character is from late hop additions.Also IPA-The huge aroma and flavor of this style is also from late(as well as bittering)hop additions with the malt character being overshadowed by the hops.

[davebl]

Can anyone advise me about the rationale behind adding late hops(last 15 mins of boil) if they stay in after the boil for say 30 mins while the wort cools. Surely they are not in long enough to extract a lot of bitterness and what bitterness they do extract might be harsh. In addition won't any flavour or aroma be driven off because the hops will be actually in the wort for 45 mins.

The alpha acids in hops are not water soluble. So to get them to dissolve, they have to isomerize in the water, by boiling very hard for long periods (such as an hour). By adding them at 30 minutes of boil time (the only period at which the temperatures get hot enough to actually isomerize), just enough AA's are extracted to add to flavoring. As soon as the heat is cut off, your wort falls below 200 degrees, which isn't hot enough for the AA's to add bitterness.

[blacklab]

In my opinion, and experience, there is almost no point in a 30 minute addition. They are not boiled for long enough to obtain much bitterness, yet lose all aroma and flavor addition over the 30 minutes they are boiled.

My theory is that you can obtain bitterness through your 60 (or 90, depending) addition, and obtain your flavor and aroma through additions after 15 minutes, and/or dryhopping.

You can see the effect of various additions and timing by playing around in brew software of your choice.

[poops4president]

I have a PA recipe that has .5 oz of 11%AA hops for 60 min to have a low backround bitterness and the rest of the IBUs are made up in hte last 15 min with 2oz of cascade... it is alot ot wast but it really lends alot of hopeflavor and a "smoother bitterness"

best thign to do is try it different ways... its always a good excuse to brew!

[Steve Urquell]

I have a PA recipe that has .5 oz of 11%AA hops for 60 min to have a low backround bitterness and the rest of the IBUs are made up in hte last 15 min with 2oz of cascade... it is alot ot wast but it really lends alot of hopeflavor and a "smoother bitterness"

best thign to do is try it different ways... its always a good excuse to brew!
This is the concept behind first wort hopping.Have you tried it yet?I'm waiting for my FWH'ed w/ magnum IPA to carbonate.Really anxious to see what it's like.

[ben the brewman]

you can pick up ibus from late hopping. i have a pale ale that i make that is great and it only gets hops at 20 min, 7 min, and 0 min and its about a 37 ibu. it takes lots of hops to get the bitterness up in late additions but it tastes great with lots of hop flavor and aroma and a bitterness on the back end.

[Ó Flannagáin]

This is the concept behind first wort hopping.Have you tried it yet?I'm waiting for my FWH'ed w/ magnum IPA to carbonate.Really anxious to see what it's like.

I've used FWH quite a bit. I honestly am not sure what it adds though.

[Steve Urquell]

I've used FWH quite a bit. I honestly am not sure what it adds though.
I found out AFTER I brewed mine that fwhs were to take the place of flavor additions.So I had already used my fwhs as my bittering hops.Looks like what I thought was going to be a 65-70ibu beer is actually going to be/taste like a 45ibu beer.At bottling mine tasted rather mild for a beer w/ 1.5oz. magnum,&3oz cascade.FWH,15min,0min,dry.

[Ó Flannagáin]

I've notice mild flavor differences. I need to analyze it better. I usually don't think about it when I'm drinking.

[bindi]

I FWH all my beers and have found the bitterness smoother [through trial and error] , I over hopped the first hops when I started this years ago, but IMHO it is just right for me as it is now.

[Steve Urquell]

I FWH all my beers and have found the bitterness smoother [through trial and error] , I over hopped the first hops when I started this years ago, but IMHO it is just right for me as it is now.
The way I now understand it is that fwh bittering is =to a 20min. addition(but w/ more flavor).Do you find this accurate and if so, do you add more hops to try and reach the bittering level appropriate for the style?

[bindi]

I have heard this 'codswollop' about it=to a 20min adds and I think it's crap, it is still boiled for 60min [90min for some] and I have found I reduced my hops as the early beers where just a little too bitter, agree that it has more flavour and it is a smooth bitteness [don't know how to describe it].